Questions and Responses – 144,000

QUESTIONS & RESPONSES

Regarding 144,000

03/25/12 | Are we wrong? Is there two hopes? Is the Bible written only to the 144,000?

07/09/12 | Rev 14:4 says the anointed is virgin men. How can woman also have the hope?

07/29/12b | Comment from a visitor who believes the Christian Greek Scriptures are primarily directed to only 144,000 people.

09/28/12 | Visitor asks several questions about 144,000 and the resurrection.

12/17/12 | Visitor explains why he believes the 144,000 of Revelation is not literal number.

02/23/13 | Visitor believes Revelation proves 144,000 will be co-rulers with Jesus over earth.

03/07/13 | Is the great crowd of Revelation 7:9 the same as the crowd of people of Revelation 5:8-10?

03/14/13 | Visitor shows that the number of sons of God are not limited to 144,000.

03/19/13a | Since only 11 faithful apostles were invited to the first Memorial, does that prove only 144,000 may partake?

04/01/14 | Evidence from a visitor that the Watchtower doctrine of 144,000 is wrong.

04/19/14 | Visitor explains in more detail when we act as king-priests as a follow up to Question and Response 4/11/14.

01/19/15 | Where does the Watchtower say that Jesus is the mediator only for 144,000?

10/31/15 | Are you saying that all 144,000 will be on earth when the great tribulation starts?

♦ Are we wrong? Is there two hopes? Is the Bible written only to the 144,000?

On March 25, 2012, we received the following comment:

“I have read your writings on a hope for all Christians. but I think you're wrong. reason for this is that the Christian Greek Scriptures are written to the church of the anointed Christians, and before the defection was in full swing, so the letters are written to the 144,000 that are redeemed from the earth. the anointed ones did not understand at the time that it would emerge a large crowd with an earthly hope, but in the 1930s realized that it would appear such a group of Christians. and today there are over 7 million people living with an earthly hope, and think of all those who have died throughout history that has not been anointed, they also have an earthly hope.

“[T]o be anointed with a heavenly hope, you have to be chosen by God. You can not choose for themselves the hope of heaven. It is God who chooses the one he gives a heavenly hope.

“So when you have been anointed with the Spirit, then you have the event in your heart, spirit as collateral in the heart, it's something you remember. Then there are 2 options, 1 you must die and be instantly transformed into a spirit. 2 is transformed into a spirit when God wants.

“To have an earthly hope is not a second rate hope, there is a great hope, think of eternal life on earth in paradise. So it is God who chooses the one he gives a heavenly hope. in heaven they shall be 144,000, rule with the King Jesus Christ.”

To the author, we thank you for taking the time to not only express your disagreement, but also to explain the basis for it. We know that many of our brothers share your views. That is why this website was developed – to provide an alternative view based on more than human reason or opinion, but solidly and soundly founded on scripture. We will, therefore, take this opportunity to share with you scriptures and reasoning based on those scriptures, to perhaps lead you to consider a different conclusion. Let’s take your comments in sections:

First, you state: “I have read your writings on a hope for all Christians. but I think you're wrong. reason for this is that the Christian Greek Scriptures are written to the church of the anointed Christians, and before the defection was in full swing, so the letters are written to the 144,000 that are redeemed from the earth.”

We wonder what you base this conclusion on. Why is it that you believe the Christian writings from Matthew through Revelation was only meant for 144,000 people to the exclusion of the 7 billion who now dwell on the earth? What is the scriptural basis for that belief? For if you are correct, that means the Father and the Christ left the remaining ones on their own, so to speak, to fend for themselves without a hope of any kind until some time in the far distant future. They did not even have the earthly hope – certainly not an everlasting one! Think of all the Christians who sacrificed their lives from the first century onward believing that they were a part of the group that would inherit the Kingdom and reside in heavenly abodes with the Christ. Does that not sound like a cruel joke?

Surely, if you are correct, Jesus knew of this great crowd of permanent earthly dwellers, yet nowhere does he ever let on that most of his disciples would not be with him. And nowhere does he encourage any of his disciples to even consider living on earth forever. We find that strange if, indeed, there is an earthly hope.

And if the Christian Greek Scriptures were only written to the 144,000 anointed believers, once that number was filled, the Bible then becomes nothing more than a historical record of ancient letters that could just as well find their place in a museum. Why do Jehovah’s Witnesses continue to mull over these writing if they are not meant for them? Are they just being good secretaries for the anointed? Aren’t they really just on the outside of God’s purpose, looking in.

And finally, why would Jesus instruct his anointed followers to go to all the nations, “teaching them to observe all the things I have commanded you.” (Matthew 28:19-20) Was not the pursuit of the heavenly hope part of the things Jesus taught them to believe? If the number was so small, isn’t that, too, a unfair tease? I doubt the Christ would engage in that type of behavior.

Then you add: “[T]he anointed ones did not understand at the time that it would emerge a large crowd with an earthly hope, but in the 1930s realized that it would appear such a group of Christians. and today there are over 7 million people living with an earthly hope, and think of all those who have died throughout history that has not been anointed, they also have an earthly hope.“

Are you implying that Jesus and the Apostles withheld this very important piece of information, namely that in about 1900 years, the anointed would be joined by a numberless crowd of believers before the anointed could receive their heavenly reward? And what about the hard work of the Apostles and early disciples? Don’t you think they could have made at least 144,000 anointed disciples within 2000 years? Jehovah’s Witnesses have made over 7 million disciples in less than 100 years. And if not, why wouldn’t Jesus give them some instructions on how to deal with this great crowd, or how to explain to them that they were not sons of God and not going to heaven, and that the Bible was not written to them? We don’t see anywhere in the scriptures where Jesus prepared them for such a contingency. Even as we read the scriptures pertaining to a future time when the Son of Man arrives, we still do not see any indication that there would be a secondary class who would live forever on earth. Notice the parable of the Sheep and the Goats:

“When the Son of man arrives in his glory, and all the angels with him, then he will sit down on his glorious throne. And all the nations will be gathered before him, and he will separate people one from another, just as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats. And he will put the sheep on his right hand, but the goats on his left. Then the king will say to those on his right, ‘Come, you who have been blessed by my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the founding of the world. . . And these [goats] will depart into everlasting cutting-off, but the [sheep] into everlasting life.” – Matthew 25:31-33, 46

So, you see the two destinies when the Son of man arrives in the future, presumably after the 1930s – either inheriting the Kingdom (heavenly life) and death. No mention of everlasting life on earth. Think, too, if righteousness leads to everlasting life in the heavens, what is the requirement for life on earth? Semi-righteousness? Half-heartedness? Or, again, is it just a cruel tease such that no matter what they do, they will never attain to the heavenly hope.

As far as the millions of people who have died not knowing they were sons of the God, we do not necessarily agree with that conclusion. We believe that most Christians who have died since the first century surely expected to be with the Christ in heaven. It is only the few Jehovah’s Witnesses who died since 1930 who may have been confused. Yet, they have lost nothing. Whether we believe in the promises of God or not, the promises will be fulfilled. When those asleep in death awaken, they will awaken exactly where the Father intended. If they were faithful, they will inherit the Kingdom. Notice in the scripture we just considered that those gaining the heavenly inheritance were surprised. They didn’t expect it. Nevertheless, they were granted it. It is as Jesus said:

“My sheep listen to my voice, and I know them, and they follow me. And I give them everlasting life, and they will by no means ever be destroyed, and no one will snatch them out of my hand. What my Father has given me is something greater than all other things, and no one can snatch them out of the hand of the Father.” – John 10:27-29

Do you agreed that the so-called “other sheep” listen to the Christ’s voice? Do you agree that they “follow” him? If so, there is nothing that can be done to snatch away their heavenly hope, not even their supreme humility.

“For I am convinced that neither death nor life nor angels nor governments nor things now here nor things to come nor powers nor height nor depth nor any other creation will be able to separate us from God’s love that is in Christ Jesus our Lord.” – Romans 8:38-39

Next you say: “[T]o be anointed with a heavenly hope, you have to be chosen by God. You can not choose for themselves the hope of heaven. It is God who chooses the one he gives a heavenly hope.”

“For a certainty I perceive that God is not partial, but in every nation the man that fears him and works righteousness is acceptable to him.” – Acts 10:34-35

This scripture puts the heavenly hope in the hands of the individual free will creatures. And if we fear God and work righteousness, he accepts us. And accepts us to what? To what? To the only hope held out in the Christian Greek Scriptures – the heavenly hope. Paul offered counsel on this matter, in the event we become confused:

“Not that I have already received it or am already made perfect, but I am pursuing to see if I may also lay hold on that for which I have also been laid hold on by Christ Jesus. Brothers, I do not yet consider myself as having laid hold on [it]; but there is one thing about it: Forgetting the things behind and stretching forward to the things ahead, I am pursuing down toward the goal for the prize of the upward call of God by means of Christ Jesus. Let us, then, as many of us as are mature, be of this mental attitude; and if you are mentally inclined otherwise in any respect, God will reveal the above [attitude] to you.” – Philippians 3:12-15

Yes, Paul was telling us if we are unclear about the need to pursue down toward the upward call, we should pray about it and God will readjust our thinking.

You also say: “So when you have been anointed with the Spirit, then you have the event in your heart, spirit as collateral in the heart, it's something you remember. Then there are 2 options, 1 you must die and be instantly transformed into a spirit. 2 is transformed into a spirit when God wants.”

We do not disagree with you here. But you may be getting the cart before the horse. Jesus came to reveal that we are ALL faith sons of God, we just don’t know about it. It is not until we become aware and accept that position that our anointing occurs. We are not anointed first and then become sons. Notice how this is stressed in Galatians:

“Now I say that as long as the heir is a babe he does not differ at all from a slave, lord of all things though he is, but he is under men in charge and under stewards until the day his father appointed beforehand. Likewise we also, when we were babes, continued enslaved by the elementary things belonging to the world. But when the full limit of the time arrived, God sent forth his Son, who came to be out of a woman and who came to be under law, that he might release by purchase those under law, that we, in turn, might receive the adoption as sons. Now because you are sons, God has sent forth the spirit of his Son into our hearts and it cries out: “Abba, Father!” So, then, you are no longer a slave but a son; and if a son, also an heir through God.” – Galatians 4:1-7

The anointing is not always associated with some outward manifestation. (Please see our Questions and Responses, February 25, 2012 which discusses in more detail the anointing.) And it is because some misled, but well-intentioned individuals stress that there must be some tremendous spiritual manifestation of the anointing that causes many humble and unassuming brothers and sisters to wrongly conclude that they must not be anointed. Therefore, the only other option is that perhaps there is some other provision for survival such as everlasting life on earth. This is a travesty. And there will be an accounting for stumbling these little ones. (Mark 9:42)

Finally, you tell us: “To have an earthly hope is not a second rate hope, there is a great hope, think of eternal life on earth in paradise. So it is God who chooses the one he gives a heavenly hope. in heaven they shall be 144,000, rule with the King Jesus Christ.”

We have NEVER referred to an earthly hope as a second rate hope. We have stated that there is no such hope of everlasting life on earth. The scriptures tell us that God’s plan for us is to inherit the heavens. Not us, but Paul said that to keep your minds on earthly things was error and shameful.

“For there are many, I used to mention them often but now I mention them also with weeping, who are walking as the enemies of the torture stake of the Christ, and their finish is destruction, and their god is their belly, and their glory consists in their shame, and they have their minds upon things of the earth. As for us, our citizenship exists in the heavens, from which place also we are eagerly waiting for a savior, the Lord Jesus Christ, who will refashion our humiliated body to be conformed to his glorious body according to the operation of the power that he has, even to subject all things to himself.” – Philippians 3:18-21

“If, however, you were raised up with the Christ, go on seeking the things above, where the Christ is seated at the right hand of God. Keep your minds fixed on the things above not on the things upon the earth.” – Colossians 3:1-2

The idea among Jehovah’s Witnesses of everlasting life on earth began as a teaching that they were a secondary heavenly class. Then over time, the teaching was changed such that the secondary heavenly class was now an earthly class. The development of this teaching is laid out for you in the Watchtower publication entitled “Revelation, Its Grand Climax at Hand,” Chapter 20. As you read that chapter, notice the authorities for the teaching – prior Watchtower publications, not scriptures. We believe the Society was acting in good faith and teaching to the best of its ability and understanding at that time. But the light has gotten brighter as we can clearly see in the in 2007 Questions from Readers. It appears to us, they were closer to the truth when they taught a “secondary heavenly class.”

As for us, we have stated in several articles that:

“The righteous themselves will possess the earth, And they will reside forever upon it.” – Psalms 37:29

We just do not believe the Bible teaches that they will reside forever on earth as individuals. (See our article Bringing it All Together.) And for as long as the righteous ones continue on the earth during that time, they will have a happy and joyous life. However, they are still faith sons of God who will attain to the heavens either, as you say, at their mortal death, or at a time of God’s choosing.

It befuddles us as to why anyone would want to shut our fellow brothers and sisters out of the Kingdom of the Heavens. How are self-professed anointed Christians harmed by that reality? Remember the question in the parable of the Workers in the Vineyard:

“Fellow, I do you no wrong. You agreed with me for a denarius, did you not? Take what is yours and go. I want to give to this last one the same as to you. Is it not lawful for me to do what I want with my own things? Or is your eye wicked because I am good?" – Matthew 20:13-15

Brothers, the Father is indeed good. And He welcomes all who exercise righteousness to “inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the founding of the world.” (Matthew 25:34)

We hope we have at least given you some things to think about. And we encourage you to stand on truth, faith, hope and love, not just theology. Theology will not save you!

♦ Rev 14:4 says the anointed is virgin men. How can woman also have the hope?

On July 9, 2012, we received the following inquiry:

“Rev 14:4 says the anointed is virgin men. How can woman also have the hope?"

To the author, thank you for your question. Here is our response:

The scripture you refer to says:

“These are the ones that did not defile themselves with women; in fact, they are virgins. These are the ones that keep following the Lamb no matter where he goes. These were bought from among mankind as firstfruits to God and to the Lamb.” – Revelation 14:4

First, please remember that Revelation is a symbolic book. The visions John saw were signs and symbols of other things.

So it is not to be taken literally.

One reason we know it is not literal in this instance is because God is not partial. He does not favor men over women.

“At this Peter opened his mouth and said: “For a certainty I perceive that God is not partial, but in every nation the man that fears him and works righteousness is acceptable to him.” – Acts 10:34-35

“You are all, in fact, sons of God through your faith in Christ Jesus. For all of you who were baptized into Christ have put on Christ. There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor freeman, there is neither male nor female; for you are all one [person] in union with Christ Jesus. Moreover, if you belong to Christ, you are really Abraham’s seed, heirs with reference to a promise.” – Galatians 3:26-29

Further, how can being with a woman defile a man? Lawful marriage was among the blessings of God.

“Did you not read that he who created them from [the] beginning made them male and female and said, ‘For this reason a man will leave his father and his mother and will stick to his wife, and the two will be one flesh’? So that they are no longer two, but one flesh. Therefore, what God has yoked together let no man put apart.” – Matthew 19:4-7

“You wives, be in subjection to [your] husbands, as it is becoming in [the] Lord. You husbands, keep on loving [your] wives and do not be bitterly angry with them.” – Colossians 3:18-19

And if we are to assume they are all literal virgins, that means that most of the apostles would not be among the 144,000. Historical records tell us the majority were married with children, so they were surely not virgins.

Remember also the account of the outpouring of the holy spirit at Pentecost. The spirit was poured out on women as well as men. Both were anointed.

“‘And in the last days,’ God says, ‘I shall pour out some of my spirit upon every sort of flesh, and your sons and your daughters will prophesy and your young men will see visions and your old men will dream dreams; and even upon my men slaves and upon my women slaves I will pour out some of my spirit in those days, and they will prophesy.” – Acts 2:17-18

In fact, we are not even sure the number 144,000 is to be taken literally. Since these portions of the vision are not to be taken literally, we can assume that the entire vision is symbolic, including the number 144,000.

We encourage you to look at the plain and open teachings of Jesus when it comes to our hope, instead of the symbolic messages in Revelation. We believe that there would be no conflict in the two since they appear to be from the same source – Jesus. And since we can understand the plain and open teachings, it would be wiser to give interpretations to the signs and symbols in the Revelation that are consistent with the plain and open teachings.

Overall, we must be careful in assigning unequivocal meanings to the signs in the Revelation. Such interpretations are nothing more than speculation and if we take the speculations too seriously, we may be leading ourselves to disappointment. We suggest you rest your faith on the plain teachings of Jesus and the apostles in the books of Matthew through Jude.

♦ Comment from a visitor who believes the Christian Greek Scriptures are primarily directed to only 144,000 people.

On July 29, 2012, we received the following comment and inquiry:

“The Christian Greek Scriptures were written to various churches in the first century, and those who received the letters looked at them as special letters addressed to themself. So we must understand that when we say that the Christian Greek Scriptures are written to the 144,000 anointed Christians, we understand the letters in a different way. They were directed to the anointed Christians.

“Revelation has its fulfillment in the day to the lord Jesus Christ, which began in 1914, where we read of the great multitude who have an earthly hope. They also need the Christian Greek Scriptures.”

To the author, we thank you for posting your comments. It appears that you are new to the site and have not had an opportunity to read many of the articles. We believe if you do so, you will be enlightened and encouraged.

We do agree that the Christian Greek Scriptures are needed by those who have an “earthly hope.” They need to read those scriptures so they will know what their true hope is, namely everlasting life in the heavens, for they, too, are among the anointed – they just don’t know it yet.

But let’s be frank, and very clear. Isn’t it true that, aside from the gospels, the book of Acts and the book of Revelation, the Christians Greek Scriptures were written to the Christians in first century? Romans was written to the congregation in Rome, Galatians was written to the congregation in Galatia, Colossians was written to the congregation in Colossae, and so forth. So really, in the truest sense of the words, the Christian Greek Scriptures were NOT written to modern day Christians. But anyone who reads the writings are benefitted because they contain the most widely available record of Jesus and his teachings, and of how his audience understood him.

These same teachings were handed down from century to century, from generation to generation with the same hope being held out to all – the heavenly hope. As Paul wrote:

“I am pursuing down toward the goal for the prize of the upward call of God by means of Christ Jesus. Let us, then, as many of us as are mature, be of this mental attitude; and if you are mentally inclined otherwise in any respect, God will reveal the above [attitude] to you.” – Philippians 3:14-15

In fact, Jesus commissioned his first century apostles and disciples to preach the good news of the kingdom as he taught it and exemplified it. And that message was to continue, unchanged, “until the conclusion of the system of things.”

“And Jesus approached and spoke to them, saying: ‘All authority has been given me in heaven and on the earth. Go therefore and make disciples of people of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the holy spirit, teaching them to observe all the things I have commanded you. And, look! I am with you all the days until the conclusion of the system of things.” – Matthew 28:18-20

No authority has been given to change the message. In fact, the Christian Greek Scriptures contain a specific warning against changing the message of Jesus:

“However, even if we or an angel out of heaven were to declare to you as good news something beyond what we declared to you as good news, let him be accursed. As we have said above, I also now say again, Whoever it is that is declaring to you as good news something beyond what you accepted, let him be accursed.” – Galatians 1:8-9

So isn’t it time to drop the self-appointed theories of superiority and favoritism of 144,000 people over the billions of mankind who have sought and served God over the past millenniums? Isn’t it time to humble ourselves and accept all men as our brothers? Isn’t it time to admit that we have misunderstood the Revelation, rather than arrogantly challenge the clear and plain teachings of Jesus and the apostles that we are all brothers with a heavenly hope in view? (Matthew 23:8-9; Galatians 3:26; Colossians 3:14-15)

Rather than reiterate what we have already published, we direct your attention to the following articles on the Christian hope: “The Cherished Earthly Hope,” “Moving Forward in Faith,” “Who are Led by Spirit?” and “Foreordained from the Founding of the World.” These articles will address your comments far more fully than we can in this section.

If, after reading the articles, you still hold the view only 144,000 are sons of God, that only 144,000 have a special relationship to the Christian Greek Scriptures, and that only 144,000 have the hope of going to heaven, then please write us again letting us know where you believe we err. Thank you again for your posting.

♦ Visitor asks several questions about 144,000 and the resurrection

On September 28, 2012, we received the following comment and inquiries:

“I have a few remarks and questions, and I would kindly ask that you would provide the answers in your Q&A section.

“I am puzzled as to what view do you uphold regarding the heavenly hope. If I understand you correctly, you believe that the Bible only offers ONE hope for salvation, and that would be the everlasting life in heavens. No everlasting life on earth, then. In that regard, I have the following questions:

“a) Do you believe that the "144.000" is a literal number? Why ?

“b) Since you hold the belief that only "144.000" are going to heaven, does that mean that there is only hope for 144.000 individuals?

“c) Since when in history have those 144.000 individuals been gathered?

“d) In what category falls "John the Baptist"? Since Jesus was clear that he wouldn't be part of the "Kingdom of Heavens", what is the hope for John the Baptist? Will he be resurrected? Where to? What about Abraham? What about David? What about Job? They all believed in the resurrection. Where to?

“e) What are the "other sheep" ?

“f) What is the "great crowd" ?

“g) If salvation is only achieved through eternal life in heavens, don't you think that God's purpose for planet earth, as expressed to Adam and Eve, would be defeated?

“h) If salvation has nothing to do with everlasting life on earth, what is the purpose of Armageddon?

“i) If God's purpose, as expressed in 2 Timothy 2:3 is that " all sorts of men should be saved and come to an accurate knowledge of truth.", how come you teach that salvation is narrowed down to only 144.000?

“j) Wouldn't it be unfair that there was no hope for all those MILLIONS of sincere, devout Christians and servants of Jehovah in the past, that only 144.000 would be saved?

“k) What would you say about the promise made to Daniel, in Daniel 12:13? And as for you yourself, go toward the end; and you will rest, but you will stand up for your lot at the end of the days? Daniel was personally assured of his future resurrection. Where to?

Please be so kind as to publicly supply the biblical answers to your claims, which I find deeply disturbing and faith-breaking, and misrepresenting Jehovah's mercy.”

To the author, we thank you for visiting our site and submitting your questions. While the answers to practically all of your questions can be found on our site, we are happy to comply with your request to publicly respond to each one. We believe that you will find the answers to be enlightening, encouraging and completely representative of our loving heavenly Father. We will take your questions in order:

“a) Do you believe that the "144.000" is a literal number? Why ?

The number 144,000 appears only in the symbolic book of Revelation. When we consider the context surrounding the number, it appears to us the number is symbolic. However, because it is a prophecy, and we do not claim to be able to interpret prophecy at this time, we refrain from making a firm, dogmatic statement as whether it is literal or not, though our inclination is that it is not literal.

“b) Since you hold the belief that only "144.000" are going to heaven, does that mean that there is only hope for 144.000 individuals?

We do not hold this belief. In fact, the entire site is dedicated to Jesus’ teaching that we are all sons of God with a heavenly hope.

“But you, do not you be called Rabbi, for one is your teacher, whereas all you are brothers. Moreover, do not call anyone your father on earth, for one is your Father, the heavenly One.” – Matthew 23:8-9

“You are all, in fact, sons of God through your faith in Christ Jesus.” – Galatians 3:26

“For all who are led by God’s spirit, these are God’s sons.” – Romans 8:14

“c) Since when in history have those 144.000 individuals been gathered?

We are unable to answer this question because we do not claim to be able to interpret prophecy at this time so as to be able to identify for a certainty who the 144,000 are.

Jesus did not say that John the Baptist would not be a part of the Kingdom of the Heavens. Here is what Jesus actually said:

“I tell you, Among those born of women there is none greater than John; but a person that is a lesser one in the kingdom of God is greater than he is.” –Luke 7:28

We believe Jesus is referring to the fact that while John preached that the kingdom was near, he had no real concept of what the kingdom was. He died before Jesus began his ministry about the kingdom of the heavens. This does not mean that John would be excluded from the Kingdom, only that he would have a ‘lesser’ position in the heavenly kingdom than a ‘lesser’ one who had the benefits of Jesus’ teachings.

Further, while men could only reach out for the kingdom after Jesus began preaching about it, the heavenly kingdom is the destiny for all mankind who desire it, even those who lived before Jesus. Paul explained that mankind waited in expectation for something, but what they did not know, until Christ came and revealed that we are all sons of God.

“Consequently I reckon that the sufferings of the present season do not amount to anything in comparison with the glory that is going to be revealed in us. For the eager expectation of the creation is waiting for the revealing of the sons of God. For the creation was subjected to futility, not by its own will but through him that subjected it, on the basis of hope that the creation itself also will be set free from enslavement to corruption and have the glorious freedom of the children of God.” – Romans 8:18-21

You might want to read the article: Freedom of the Children of God for a more in-depth explanation of that scripture.

Also, please note this scripture:

"But I tell you that many from eastern parts and western parts will come and recline at the table with Abraham and Isaac and Jacob in the kingdom of the heavens.” – Matthew 8:11

So not only will faithful pre-Christian Jews be in the kingdom of heaven, but even men from the east and the west. Yes, all mankind is invited!

And we want you to consider one other very important point. When certain Sadducees inquired about who would marry whom in the resurrection, Jesus said:

“You are mistaken, because you know neither the Scriptures nor the power of God; for in the resurrection neither do men marry nor are women given in marriage, but are as angels in heaven.” – Matthew 22:29-30

If those resurrected are ‘as angels in heaven’ and apparently without sex organs, why would such beings be returned to live on earth along with marry-able, fully-equipped beings?

“e) What are the "other sheep" ?

You are referring to the following scripture:

“And I have other sheep, which are not of this fold; those also I must bring, and they will listen to my voice, and they will become one flock, one shepherd.” – John 10:16

While Jesus does not specifically identify the other sheep, Paul makes a parallel reference that leads us to a conclusion as to their identity:

“But now in union with Christ Jesus you who were once far off have come to be near by the blood of the Christ. For he is our peace, he who made the two parties one and destroyed the wall in between that fenced them off. By means of his flesh he abolished the enmity, the Law of commandments consisting in decrees, that he might create the two peoples in union with himself into one new man and make peace; and that he might fully reconcile both peoples in one body to God through the torture stake, because he had killed off the enmity by means of himself.” – Ephesians 2:13-16

By this scripture, we believe the ‘other sheep’ are the gentile Christians who joined with the Jewish Christians to become one flock.

“f) What is the "great crowd" ?

We assume you are referring to the ‘great crowd’ that is mentioned in the book of Revelation:

“After these things I saw, and, look! a great crowd, which no man was able to number, out of all nations and tribes and peoples and tongues, standing before the throne and before the Lamb, dressed in white robes; and there were palm branches in their hands.” – Revelation 7:9

As we mentioned earlier, we refrain from attempting interpretations of prophecy at this time. So our answer to your question is that we do not know for sure.

“g) If salvation is only achieved through eternal life in heavens, don't you think that God's purpose for planet earth, as expressed to Adam and Eve, would be defeated?

No. The Bible states that God’s purpose for the earth is that it be inhabited. (Isaiah 45:18) As men and women achieve their heavenly inheritance, there will be others will be born and mature on earth. You assume that at some point in the future, men and women would stop bearing children. We see nothing to support that idea. You might want to read our article: The Real Hope for Life on Earth.

“h) If salvation has nothing to do with everlasting life on earth, what is the purpose of Armageddon?

Again, you are asking us to interpret prophecy. We cannot do that at this time. Our purpose, at this time, is to clarify the open and plain teachings of Jesus Christ, not interpret prophecy. You may wish to direct your questions concerning prophesy to another ministry that claims to know those things.

We do not teach that. You have us confused with what the Watchtower Bible & Tract Society, or another ministry, teaches. Our ministry is to correct that idea and teach that ‘all sorts of men will be saved.’

“j) Wouldn't it be unfair that there was no hope for all those MILLIONS of sincere, devout Christians and servants of Jehovah in the past, that only 144.000 would be saved?

Yes. It is indeed unfair. And it is not true. The Bible does not teach that. Our ministry is to help others know that that teaching is not accurate. Please read our article The Reality of the Earthly Hope and The Real Hope for Life on Earth.

Again, we do not attempt to interpret prophecy at this time. However, Daniel was a faithful servant of God, so we fully expect that he will be resurrected to the heavens.

Now, we have publicly supplied our answers to your questions as you requested. Perhaps you can now look at the article we pointed you to, along with the other articles on our site. In particular, you might also want to see Fundamental Beliefs for a Living Faith which sets forth and explains our statement of beliefs, as well as Being Born of Spirit, and Worshiping with Spirit and Truth. These articles will give you a better idea of our ministry. And please feel free to write us again.

♦ Visitor explains why he believes the 144,000 of Revelation is not literal number.

On December 17, 2012, we received the following comment and inquiry:

“Jehovah’s Witnesses firmly believe that the number of those who will go to heaven is limited to 144,000. Yet the promise made to Abraham was that his seed would become "like the grains of sand that are on the seashore." This is interpreted as being an unknown number (at that time), yet, wherever the expression is used in the Hebrew Scriptures it refers to a very large number. Please see Joshua 11:4; Judges 7:12; 1 Samuel 13:5; 1 Kings 4:20; Job 29:18; Psalm 139:18; Isaiah 10:22. Could it be that the number 144,000 is symbolic of a much greater number as are most of the numbers in the book of Revelation?”

To the author, thank you for your email. We find your reasoning, asserting that the 144,000 referred to at Revelation 7:4 and Revelation 14:1-5 is not literal, is very interesting and even sound, to a certain extent. As we mention on several occasions, and in the introduction to this section, we refrain from responding to emails that seek determinative interpretations of the Book of Revelation. Our view is that the matters that the Apostle John was privileged to see involve matters of an earthly nature as well as extra-terrestrial matters – matters beyond the confines of our planet, matters that are foreign to the human experience, and events that will occur beyond the human lifespan. As such, we are not at this time authorized to make definitive statements about Revelation’s fulfillment.

However, we believe that your email provides us with an opportunity to make a few comments that will not overstep our commission and may even broaden our visitors’ view of the 144,000 and the ‘great crowd.’ So, let’s take a look at your reasoning in detail, and then we will add our comments as food for thought, and allow all who read it to formulate their own conclusions.

We remind you that our conclusions are not definitive nor are they dogma. The reader is free to accept or reject them at will. We make no inferences that failure to agree with our statements have any bearing on the reader’s sonship or their relationship with the Father and His Christ.

The subject scriptures in Revelation state:

“And I saw, and, look! the Lamb standing upon the Mount Zion, and with him a hundred and forty-four thousand having his name and the name of his Father written on their foreheads. And I heard a sound out of heaven as the sound of many waters and as the sound of loud thunder; and the sound that I heard was as of singers who accompany themselves on the harp playing on their harps. And they are singing as if a new song before the throne and before the four living creatures and the elders; and no one was able to master that song but the hundred and forty-four thousand, who have been bought from the earth. These are the ones that did not defile themselves with women; in fact, they are virgins. These are the ones that keep following the Lamb no matter where he goes. These were bought from among mankind as firstfruits to God and to the Lamb, and no falsehood was found in their mouths; they are without blemish.” – Revelation 14:1-5

“And I heard the number of those who were sealed, a hundred and forty-four thousand, sealed out of every tribe of the sons of Israel.” – Revelation 7:4

The author’s argument develops like this:

• The seed of Abraham will become “like the stars of the heavens” and “like the grains of sand on the seashore:”

“I shall surely bless you and I shall surely multiply your seed like the stars of the heavens and like the grains of sand that are on the seashore; and your seed will take possession of the gate of his enemies. And by means of your seed all nations of the earth will certainly bless themselves due to the fact that you have listened to my voice.’” – Genesis 22:17-18

• Next, the author points out that when the Hebrew Scriptures use the phrase “like the grains of sand,” they are referring to a large unknown and uncountable number:

“So they went out, they and all their camps with them, a people as numerous as the grains of sand that are on the seashore for multitude, and very many horses and war chariots.” – Joshua 11:4

“Now Midian and Amalek and all the Easterners were plumped in the low plain as numerous as locusts; and their camels were without number, as numerous as the grains of sand that are on the seashore.” – Judges 7:12

“And the Philistines, for their part, collected themselves together to fight against Israel, thirty thousand war chariots and six thousand horsemen and people like the grains of sand that are upon the seashore for multitude; and they went their way up and began camping in Michmash to the east of Beth-aven.” – 1 Samuel 13:5

“Judah and Israel were many, like the grains of sand that are by the sea for multitude, eating and drinking and rejoicing.” – 1 Kings 4:20

“And I used to say, ‘Within my nest I shall expire, And like the grains of sand I shall multiply [my] days.” – Job 29:18

“Were I to try to count them, they are more than even the grains of sand. I have awaked, and yet I am still with you.” – Psalms 139:18

“For although your people, O Israel, would prove to be like the grains of sand of the sea, a mere remnant among them will return. An extermination decided upon will be flooding through in righteousness.” – Isaiah 10:22

• Then, the author points out that anointed sons of the Kingdom are the seed of Abraham:

“You are all, in fact, sons of God through your faith in Christ Jesus. For all of you who were baptized into Christ have put on Christ. There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor freeman, there is neither male nor female; for you are all one [person] in union with Christ Jesus. Moreover, if you belong to Christ, you are really Abraham’s seed, heirs with reference to a promise.” – Galatians 3:26-29

• One would naturally deduce from these factors that the sons of the Kingdom would therefore be “like the grains of the sand of the seashore.”

Based on this reasoning, we would have to agree with the author that the number of the sons of God – the anointed sons of the Kingdom – would be a very large number, so large that one could not count them. Yet, all would agree that it is fairly easy to count 144,000. The Society regularly counts active Jehovah’s Witnesses into the millions, the observers at the Memorial celebrations in excess of 19,000,000, and hours spent in the ministry in excess of 1,000,000,000!

But here is where we depart from the author’s conclusion: We suggest that the number 144,000 may be literal to some group, but it is not the literal number of all of the anointed sons of God. Let’s take another look at the scriptures in Revelation:

Revelation 7:4 refers only to those who were “sealed out of every tribe of the sons of Israel.” That limits the number to a particular race of mankind (literally or figuratively). Then Revelation 14:1-5 refers only to those standing on symbolic Mount Zion. Now, of course, these two groups could be the same group – 144,000 of the sons of Israel standing on a symbolic mount. But this does not mean that these 144,000 are the only ones bought from the earth.

Revelation 14:4 says they are “bought from among mankind as firstfruits.” One could easily assume that if there are first fruits, there must be ‘second fruits’ that are also bought from among mankind. These second fruits might not be from the tribes of Israel, and they might be situated in places other than on top of the symbolic mount.

And notice this:

“After these things I saw, and, look! a great crowd, which no man was able to number, out of all nations and tribes and peoples and tongues, standing before the throne and before the Lamb, dressed in white robes; and there were palm branches in their hands. And they keep on crying with a loud voice, saying: “Salvation [we owe] to our God, who is seated on the throne, and to the Lamb.” – Revelation 7:9-10

And notice what the ‘four living creatures’ and the ‘24 elders’ say about them:

“And they sing a new song, saying: “You are worthy to take the scroll and open its seals, because you were slaughtered and with your blood you bought persons for God out of every tribe and tongue and people and nation, and you made them to be a kingdom and priests to our God, and they are to rule as kings over the earth.” – Revelation 5:9-10

These are not the 144,000 of the ‘tribes of the sons of Israel.’ This is the “great crowd” of all nations. Does this not seem to say that the ‘great crowd’ will be the ones ruling as kings and priests over the earth, not the 144,000?

Interesting thought. This is why we refrain from supporting the current interpretations of Revelation’s symbolisms. It is also why we strongly resist developing dogma based on interpretations that are so obviously limited in spiritual vision. The Revelation is a far larger and more complex revealing than man has heretofore realized.

For these reasons, we believe it is wiser to rest our hopes for salvation on Jesus’ actual, original, plain and open teachings. We will all eventually understand these matters, but until then, let us rest our hopes on what is not hidden. That is the most important undertaking for Christians of our day. If we cannot understand the things that are plain, how will we ever understand those that are hidden?

We sincerely appreciate the author’s email and inquiry, as it has certainly provided evidence that the seed of Abraham – the anointed sons of God – is not circumscribed to 144,000. So many of our brothers and sisters need to know that the Father has not limited the number of those He draws to Himself through the ministry of Christ Jesus and the outpouring of the Spirit of Truth.

This, we believe, is as much as we can say on this matter at this time. But if it is the Father’s will for us, and circumstances allow us more freedom, perhaps we will be able to go further in this discussion.

Until then, your comments, which we suspect may be many, are welcomed.

♦ Visitor believes Revelation proves 144,000 will be co-rulers with Jesus over earth.

On February 23, 2013, we received an email that included the following comment and inquiries:

“I understand, you know that Jesus did not tell any specific number while he was on earth for the little flock. But later he gave his especially beloved apostle John knowledge through visions, that he wrote down in the Revelation book. . . . I take the words of the Revelation book seriously, because I believe Jesus handed over the information there through his angel to John. John wrote it down to all Christians. And when Revelation book tells the number 144,000, I take it literally. Why not? Do you accept the Revelation book is “the Revelation of Jesus Christ” as says the first verse of Revelation 1? [Then the inquirer cites Revelation 7:4, 14:1,3-5, and 5:9 in support of his points which we will cite below.]

To the author, thank you for your email. We wanted to respond to this inquiry both privately and publicly for the benefit of our other visitors.

To answer your last question, yes, we do accept the book of Revelation as part of the inspired Bible. But we do not believe it is wise to establish our doctrinal beliefs on man’s various interpretations of the prophecies in the book. We will show you why.

You acknowledge that Jesus did not state the number of his co-rulers while he was on earth. But you assert that he did give a number to John who recorded that number in the Book of Revelation. We agree with you that John was given a vision of a group of individuals who total the specific number of 144,000. But we also know that the information Jesus revealed to John was symbolic:

“A revelation by Jesus Christ, which God gave him, to show his slaves the things that must shortly take place. And he sent forth his angel and presented [it] in signs through him to his slave John, who bore witness to the word God gave and to the witness Jesus Christ gave, even to all the things he saw.” – Revelation 1:1-2

Since the Revelation was given ‘in signs, it is possible that the number 144,000 is not literal, but symbolic. So how can we know for sure? We submit that it cannot be known for sure at this time. For that reason we do not emphatically reject or assert that the number 144,000 is literal.

We believe the unwavering assertion that the number is literal and that there would be only 144,000 co-rulers with Jesus is the sole reason why many choose to believe that there must be some other destiny for the remaining billions of mankind, i.e., an earthly hope. But let’s consider some other thoughts:

First, is it possible that many who are resurrected to the heavens would not be rulers over the earth, but mere residents? And is it possible that some could be rulers, but rulers over others who do not live on earth? Remember what the Apostle Paul wrote:

“Eye has not seen and ear has not heard, neither have there been conceived in the heart of man the things that God has prepared for those who love him.” – 1 Corinthians 2:9

Second, and more importantly, considered these matters. We believe they will open your eyes to the fact that it is not wise to turn prophetic interpretations into doctrines:

Revelation 7:4 states:

“And I heard the number of those who were sealed, a hundred and forty-four thousand, sealed out of every tribe of the sons of Israel.”

Notice that the 144,000 are from the 12 tribes of Israel; but neither that verse, nor any surrounding verse states that they are to be kings and priests.

Revelation 14:1, 3-5 states:

“And I saw, and, look! the Lamb standing upon the Mount Zion, and with him a hundred and forty-four thousand having his name and the name of his Father written on their foreheads. . . . And they are singing as if a new song before the throne and before the four living creatures and the elders; and no one was able to master that song but the hundred and forty-four thousand, who have been bought from the earth. These are the ones that did not defile themselves with women; in fact, they are virgins. These are the ones that keep following the Lamb no matter where he goes. These were bought from among mankind as firstfruits to God and to the Lamb, and no falsehood was found in their mouths; they are without blemish.”

Notice that this group of 144,000 sings a new song, but again, they are not said to be kings and priests.

Revelation 7:9, 13-14 states:

“After these things I saw, and, look! a great crowd, which no man was able to number, out of all nations and tribes and peoples and tongues, standing before the throne and before the Lamb, dressed in white robes; and there were palm branches in their hands. . . . And in response one of the elders said to me: “These who are dressed in the white robes, who are they and where did they come from?” So right away I said to him: “My lord, you are the one that knows.” And he said to me: “These are the ones that come out of the great tribulation, and they have washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.”

Notice the great crowd are not from the 12 tribes of Israel, but from ‘all nations and tribes and peoples and tongues,’ and are wearing white robes. They are the ones who come out of the great tribulation.

And Revelation 5:8-10, says:

“And when he took the scroll, the four living creatures and the twenty-four elders fell down before the Lamb, having each one a harp and golden bowls that were full of incense, and the [incense] means the prayers of the holy ones. And they sing a new song, saying: ‘You are worthy to take the scroll and open its seals, because you were slaughtered and with your blood you bought persons for God out of every tribe and tongue and people and nation, and you made them to be a kingdom and priests to our God, and they are to rule as kings over the earth.’

Notice it says that those who ‘sing a new song’ – the four living creatures and the 24 elders – herald that the people from ‘every tribe, tongue, people and nation’ are the ones who will be kings and priests!

Again, we remember that this entire book is ‘presented in signs,’ but it appears to say that those who are to rule as kings and priests on the earth are the great crowd, not the 144,000! Thus, the entire two-hope theory goes out the window if the ones who rule as kings and priests are, in fact, the great crowd! And to us, it seems logical that those who rule as kings and priests over the earth would be visible to the ones they rule over. But that’s just our thoughts.

As you well know, every generation since the prophesy was written has had a different interpretation of its meaning. And each generation has been wrong. So, what if we rested our entire eternal future on your interpretation, when perhaps the interpretation as we see it is the true one? Or vice versa. One of us would be greatly misled! Why not wait and see how events unfold rather than teaching our own interpretations as doctrine. In fact, rather than focus on matters which are only speculation at best, why not focus on those things that are not speculation.

Why not take Paul’s advice and ‘do our utmost to be found finally by him spotless and unblemished and in peace’ (2 Peter 3:14) in our worship and in the ministry that Jesus taught? Because no matter how the prophecy turns out, those who follow Jesus’ example and ministry have a guarantee of everlasting life. As Jesus said:

“Stop storing up for yourselves treasures upon the earth, where moth and rust consume, and where thieves break in and steal. Rather, store up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust consumes, and where thieves do not break in and steal. For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also.” – Matthew 6:19-21

Our hearts are in heaven and our treasures are in heaven. Shouldn’t our hopes be in heaven, too?

♦ Is the great crowd of Revelation 7:9 the same as the crowd of people of Revelation 5:8-10?

On March 7, 2013, we received a comment regarding our recent article The Great Crowd of Partakers where we stated that the 144,000 are not prophesied to be the kings and priests pursuant to Revelation 5:8-10, but rather the kings and priests are said to be a great crowd, as identified in Revelation 7:9.

Here are the scriptures we were referring to:

“And when he took the scroll, the four living creatures and the twenty-four elders fell down before the Lamb, having each one a harp and golden bowls that were full of incense, and the [incense] means the prayers of the holy ones. And they sing a new song, saying: ‘You are worthy to take the scroll and open its seals, because you were slaughtered and with your blood you bought persons for God out of every tribe and tongue and people and nation, and you made them to be a kingdom and priests to our God, and they are to rule as kings over the earth.’” – Revelation 5:8-10

“After these things I saw, and, look! a great crowd, which no man was able to number, out of all nations and tribes and peoples and tongues, standing before the throne and before the Lamb, dressed in white robes; and there were palm branches in their hands.” – Revelation 7:9

And here is what the article said:

“Here, John is told that a multi-national great crowd are the ones who would be kings and priests! How did we miss this point? How did those who developed the Doctrine of the 144,000 fail to see that the kings and priests are not the 144,000, but are really a ‘great multi-national crowd?’ This clarification makes a huge difference in the fundamental teachings of Jehovah’s Witnesses. It reveals that the teaching that only a limited number of mankind would qualify as kings and priests is a misinterpretation – an error.

“Instead, John the Revelator tells us that those who would serve as kings and priests are unnumberable! No man is able to count the number of those who would serve as kings and priests. Doesn’t that now effect our view of who can and should participate in the Memorial Supper? And doesn’t it now effect our view of who can enter the Kingdom of the Heavens? It certainly should!

Here is the visitor’s comment:

“‘You bought persons’ [from Revelation 5:8-10] does not say ‘a great crowd.’ It could mean one person of each tribe, tongue, people and nation. In that case, the crowd is maybe great, but it is perhaps less than 144 000. It could mean a lot of people, but it is not sure that it refers to Revelations 7:9. So ‘kings and priests’ must not be the ‘great crowd.’”

To the author, thank you for your email. You make a good point. We did not mean to say that the ‘great crowd’ of Revelation 7:9 is the same group as the persons ‘out of every tribe and tongue and people and nations’ of Revelation 5:9-10. Although they could be the same. We mentioned that the group at Revelation 5:9-10 who are said to be kings and priests are an unnumbered crowd – we do not know the number.

As you said, it could be smaller than 144,000; but you must also realize that it could be quite a bit larger. It could be millions. John does not reveal the number. So, our point is that since we do not know the number of those who will be kings and priests, the Governing Body cannot use the number of 144,000 to teach that there is a limit to those who would be in the ‘covenant for a kingdom’ or who would have the heavenly hope.

At this point in our ministry, we do not attempt to interpret prophecy. So, we are not trying to interpret the identity of the ‘great crowd’ or the ‘144,000.’ We are simply showing that it is unwise to use the symbolic and prophetic book of Revelation to establish doctrines, especially doctrines having to do with matters of eternal salvation.

If you have any more thoughts on this matter, please feel free to write us again.

♦ Visitor shows that the number of sons of God are not limited to 144,000.

On March 14, 2013, we received the following comment:

“1 John 5:1 is a clear answer to any attempt to limit the number of the anointed: [According to the New English Translation of the Bible (NET)] ‘EVERYONE who believes that Jesus is the Christ has been fathered by God.’ Also from the NET Bible. ‘The verb gennao- here means to be fathered by God and thus a child of God. The imagery in 1 John is that of a male parent who fathers children.’ A similar thought is found at John 1:12 from the NET Bible ‘But to ALL who have received him--those who believe in his name--he has given the right to become God's children.’ CAN ANYTHING BE CLEARER!! And these words were written AFTER the book of Revelation!”

To the author, thank you for your email. We agree with you. The matter is quite clear. There is no limit to those who could be faith sons of God and thus, no limit to those who have the heavenly hope. You make an excellent point that the words in 1 John 5:1 and John 1:12 were written AFTER the book of Revelation, after John received the vision of the 144,000.

According to the book, “All Scripture Is Inspired of God and Beneficial,” published by the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society of New York, Inc., the writing of the book of Revelation was completed circa 96 C.E., whereas the writing of the books of 1 John and the Gospel According to John were both completed circa 98 C.E.

In your email, you quoted from the New English Translation of the Bible (NET). For the benefit of our visitors, we will provide a few more translations so that all can be sure of what John the Revelator himself believed as to how many believers could become sons of God.

Regarding 1 John 5:1:

“Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: and every one that loveth him that begat loveth him also that is begotten of him.” – King James Version

“Every one who believes that Jesus is the Christ is a child of God, and every one who loves the parent loves the child.” – Revised Standard Version

“Everyone believing that Jesus is the Christ has been born from God, and everyone who loves the one that caused to be born loves him who has been born from that one.” – New World Translation

Regarding John 1:12:

“But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name.” – King James Version

“But to all who received him, who believed in his name, he gave power to become children of God.” – Revised Standard Version

“However, as many as did receive him, to them he gave authority to become God’s children, because they were exercising faith in his name.” – New World Translation

These scriptures leave no doubt that ‘all who believe’ have the power to become sons of God by virtue of their faith. Thus, anyone who attempts to limit that number is in direct conflict with the words of Jesus as recorded by John the Revelator.

Thank you again, and please continue to share your observations.

♦ Since only 11 faithful apostles were invited to the first Memorial, does that prove only 144,000 may partake?

On March 19, 2013, we received a comment from a visitor regarding an article he read on another website about who may partake at the Memorial Supper. We have already written articles on most of the issues raised, except this one:

“What are your thoughts to the argument that only 144,000 are anointed based on the fact that only 11 faithful apostles were invited to the first Memorial Supper?”

To the author, thank you for your inquiry. We read the link to the article you provided, and we find a few problems.

The writer of the article commits the same errors that so many Bible students commit. The writer uses prophecy to interpret the plain and open teachings, instead of using the plain and open teachings to interpret prophecy. The writer uses isolated verses to prove points while failing to consider the context. And the writer tries to pour the ‘old wine into the new wineskins.’

We believe if anyone simply looks at what Jesus taught, and what the Christian Bible writers preached, there would not be so much confusion. But these are difficult things to convey to people who have set themselves up as prophets with their own private interpretations, as we are seeing with the Governing Body. (2 Peter 1:20) Without a true spiritual intervention and a divine revelation, all prophetic interpretations are simply opinions. (We note the Governing Body has not yet claimed to receive divine intervention or divine inspiration.) We ourselves have written many articles, but in them, we are not interpreting prophecy. We are showing what the plain and open teachings are and what the prophesies say, not what they mean. But let’s get to the issue raised.

The fact that only the 11 faithful Apostles were participants in the first Memorial Supper is not proof that only a limited number of persons were admitted in the covenant instituted and mediated by Jesus. The Passover was not a large group or congregational commemoration. The Passover was conducted in private homes with close family and friends. (Matthew 26:17-19) So it is not unusual that the first Memorial Supper included only Jesus’ close friends.

We wrote an article on the subject of partakers based on the plain and open teachings of Jesus entitled The Great Crowd of Partakers. It discusses, and effectively invalidates, the Doctrine of the 144,000, which is the basis for the argument that only a limited number can partake at the Memorial Supper. See also Eating and Drinking Worthily, which shows plainly that all who exercise faith in Jesus Christ must continue participating in the Memorial Supper until Christ returns. (1 Corinthians 11:23-26)

These are our thoughts.

♦ 04/01/14 | Evidence from a visitor that the Watchtower doctrine of 144,000 is wrong.

On April 1, 2014, we received the following comment regarding Question and Response 3/31/14:

“That was a great answer to the person that called you apostate. I agree with you, like many do, that the governing body are the true apostates. They just keep on making up doctrines as time passes to maintain people blind. I believe that the teachings from our Lord Jesus Christ are simple. The governing body is messing around those teachings. I don't even know how they came up that only 144,000 are going to heaven when in the 1st century there were 1 million only in the roman empire. I googled it and here is what came up (unless the reference is from Satan):

"According to the World Christian Encyclopedia (1982), it is estimated that by A.D. 100 there were 1 million Christians in the Roman Empire out of a population of 181 million. This means that by the end of the first century less than 1 percent of the population (0.6% to be exact) was Christian."

“My question is: Were they all false Christians belonging to Babylon the great? God couldn't pick 144,000 by then? If they were picked by then, what was the hope for the rest? Till 1935 when supposedly the heavenly call ended there was only one hope. Were there all the Christians that were killed, murdered, persecuted... etc, not worthy of the heavenly call? Only a few men from Brooklyn living in nice apartment complex with luxury are worthy to be picked by God himself? I don't see anything on the scriptures that would show me that God picked them from the rest of mankind. These men are frauds and liars. And I believe that they are the real antichrist because they don't follow Jesus according to His teachings.”

To the author, thank you for your email. We never thought to Google that! Very insightful. We publish it here to show to our brothers how flawed and how unreasonable the Watchtower doctrine is. To assume that the apostles and 1st century disciples could not produce 144,000 sons of God is ridiculous and very demeaning to their ministry. There is not much more that needs to be said.

Thank you again for your email.

♦ Visitor explains in more detail when we act as king-priests as a follow up to Question and Response 4/11/14.

On April 19, 2014, we received the following comment:

“Regarding your email yesterday responding to the questioner about the Kingdom, etc., [Question and Response 4/11/14] just a few scriptural thoughts that do not involve future prophecy. My comments do not attempt to broach the entire scope of the questions raised, only a particular aspect of the "reality" Christians now have in Christ relative to these questions. (Col. 2:17)

“Notice the use of the past tense in the following that clearly indicate Christ's disciples have been already brought into the Kingdom and Priesthood spiritually:

"He...transferred (at Pentecost, Acts 2) us into the Kingdom" -Col.1:13

"He made us to be a kingdom, priests" -Rev. 1:6

"He raised us up together and seated us together in the heavenly places in union with Christ Jesus."-Eph.2:6

“These verses obviously portray Christians as presently (not future, but now) seated with Jesus ruling as kings, ministering as priests, in a spiritual, not literal sense.

“Notice now the shift from past to present tense in Rev. 5:10 "you made (past) them to the God of us kingdom and priests, and they are reigning (present) upon the earth." (Kingdom Interlinear)

“Christian disciples, all of whom are in the New Covenant, are already a "kingdom of priests" (Ex. 19:6) in a spiritual sense. They are "God's sons ... received (past tense) a spirit of adoption ... that we are (present tense) God's children ... We are (present tense) also heirs-heirs indeed of God, but joint heirs with Christ." -Rom.8:14-17

“No, Christians are certainly not presently ruling as literally resurrected kings or priests. -2 Tim.2:18; 1 Cor. 4:8. But why is this now true in a spiritual sense, and not just in the future in heaven with God and Christ? 1 Pet. 2:5-9 tells us again that it is now, on earth "you are his holy priests. (To do what?) Through the mediation of Jesus Christ, you offer spiritual sacrifices that please God ...You are royal priests ... (Why?) As a result, you can show others the goodness of God." (New Living Translation) Thus Christians are given the seriously important responsibility as royal ambassadors to the world of bringing others to him. (2 Cor. 5:18-21) We join with Christ in his priestly work of reconciling God and people.”

To the author, thank you for your enlightening email. We want to share these thoughts with our readers. The series The Royal Priesthood and the Holy Nation that we referred to in response to the above-mentioned email reaches the same conclusion – that we are now a kingdom of priests who are reconciling man to God. Although the scriptures use the terms kings and priests, we think of them in modern terms as administrators and ministers – those who organize an arrangement and those who personally help the people. The series Ambassadors Substituting for Christ, which is a part of the same Foundation Articles as The Royal Priesthood, refers to these ‘priests’ as ‘ambassadors,’ as do you. When we bring the terms into a more modern vernacular, their meanings become clearer.

The problem we had with the questioner’s email mentioned above was that it was based on a faulty premise and assumed matters as true which are in fact a distortion of what Jesus actually taught. It appeared to us that the inquirer was interested in a discussion about the earthly hope, in essence asserting that because there are king-priests, then there must be a group who lives on earth forever over whom the king-priests rule. We directed her to The Royal Priesthood series because it helps to resolve the two-hope theory, in spite of the two errors we mentioned in the response. Once the two-hope theory is resolved, we believe her questions will likewise be resolved, especially more so with addition of your comments.

Since we find your development of scriptures enlightening, we have posted it here in full (without revision) for others who have not chosen to read The Royal Priesthood or who want a quick response to the king-priest issue. Your astute Bible study is most appreciated.

♦ Where does the Watchtower say that Jesus is the mediator only for 144,000?

On January 19, 2015, we received the following inquiry:

“Hello. I just read the email of the former Elder [January 18, 2015]. Could he give us the references of the Watchtower in question, which states that only through the Governing Body can we have a relationship with the Father. Thank you kindly for an answer.”

To the author, thank you for your email. We contacted the brother and here is his response:

Here are the two references:

*** w79 4/1 p. 31 Questions From Readers *** Is Jesus the “mediator” only for anointed Christians?

The term “mediator” occurs just six times in the Christian Greek Scriptures and Scripturally is always used regarding a formal covenant.

Moses was the “mediator” of the Law covenant made between God and the nation of Israel. (Gal. 3:19, 20) Christ, though, is the “mediator of a new covenant” between Jehovah and spiritual Israel, the “Israel of God” that will serve as kings and priests in heaven with Jesus. (Heb. 8:6; 9:15; 12:24; Gal. 6:16) At a time when God was selecting those to be taken into that new covenant, the apostle Paul wrote that Christ was the “one mediator between God and men.” (1 Tim. 2:5) Reasonably Paul was here using the word “mediator” in the same way he did the other five times, which occurred before the writing of 1 Timothy 2:5, referring to those then being taken into the new covenant for which Christ is “mediator.” So in this strict Biblical sense Jesus is the “mediator” only for anointed Christians.

The new covenant will terminate with the glorification of the remnant who are today in that covenant mediated by Christ. The “great crowd” of “other sheep” that is forming today is not in that new covenant. However, by their associating with the “little flock” of those yet in that covenant they come under benefits that flow from that new covenant. During the millennium Jesus Christ will be their king, high priest and judge.

*** w13 7/15 p. 20 pars. 2-3 “Who Really Is the Faithful and Discreet Slave?” ***

Paragraph 2: The timely spiritual food we receive is proof that Jesus, the Head of the congregation, is keeping his promise to feed us. Through whom is he doing so? When giving the sign of his presence, Jesus said that he would use “the faithful and discreet slave” to give “food at the proper time” to his domestics. (Read Matthew 24:45-47.) That faithful slave is the channel through which Jesus is feeding his true followers in this time of the end. It is vital that we recognize the faithful slave. Our spiritual health and our relationship with God depend on this channel.—Matt. 4:4; John 17:3.

Paragraph 10: Who, then, is the faithful and discreet slave? In keeping with Jesus’ pattern of feeding many through the hands of a few, that slave is made up of a small group of anointed brothers who are directly involved in preparing and dispensing spiritual food during Christ’s presence. Throughout the last days, the anointed brothers who make up the faithful slave have served together at headquarters. In recent decades, that slave has been closely identified with the Governing Body of Jehovah’s Witnesses. Note, however, that the word “slave” in Jesus’ illustration is singular, indicating that this is a composite slave. The decisions of the Governing Body are thus made collectively.

We hope that answers your question. If not, let us know.

♦ Are you saying that all 144,000 will be on earth when the great tribulation starts?

On October 31, 2015, we received the following inquiry:

“Your commentary "We Want To Go With You Part 5" is one of the best piece of analysis I've come across on the site. That being said I was left a bit puzzled about your interpretation of Rev 7:1-4, though you do not support the society's interpretation. You go on to say "All 144000 are on earth at the start of the great tribulation, not just a remnant". [Then the author presents a possible interpretation of who he believes are part of the 144,000 and how many he thinks might be on earth at that time.]

To the author, thank you for visiting our site and sending your email. Had you provided a private email address, we may have been able to discuss the details of your interpretation with you personally. But since we can only respond publicly, we omitted your interpretation consistent with our policy of not publicly promoting the interpretation of Bible prophecy on this website. Nevertheless, please know that we do appreciate your thoughtful effort.

With respect to what we published in the above referenced article, please understand that we are not giving an interpretation of who the 144,000 are, nor are we saying that all 144,000 would be, or would not be, on earth at the beginning of a great tribulation. We are merely showing that the Watchtower’s 144,000 Doctrine is not consistent with what John actually wrote. Our conclusion is based solely on what is written in the prophecy and not on our interpretations or speculations, nor by comparing or contrasting it with other Bible characters, prophecies, parables or teachings. We consider the words of the prophecy for what they actually say. Nothing more. We hope you understand that distinction.

In our opinion, the identification of the 144,000 must await a further revelation and, as such, is far too speculative to base one’s faith on being, or not being, one of them. In fact, we have heard a few different interpretations of who they are and a couple of them sound quite plausible, but neither of them limits the number of Christians who might go to heaven. Nevertheless, we maintain our position that even those interpretations are too speculative to rest one’s faith on. It is much wiser to rest our faith on the things Jesus plainly and openly taught.

Accordingly, we can say for a certainty that there is nothing Jesus ever taught that gives any indication that he was only preparing places in heaven for a small number of his followers, or that only a small number of his followers should partake at the Memorial Supper, or that only a small number of his followers are his brothers, or that it was or is the Father’s purpose for his followers to live forever on earth. Those ideas are completely absent! So whoever one may think the 144,000 are, or however many one supposes will be on earth at any given point in time, we are certain the true interpretation will not conflict with what Jesus actually taught. And we are also certain that as long as we exercise faith in Jesus and his plain teachings, and do the will of God to the best of our ability, we will always be on the favorable side of events, no matter what the future holds and no matter who the 144,000 turn out to be.

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